My wife and I have been having an ongoing discussion about the divisiveness of words.
Her focus is on 1 Timothy 6:4, 20 and 2 Tim. 2:14, 23 which all talk about doctrines and words that cause arguments.
My focus is on 2 Timothy 2:25-26, which tells us to instruct those who are given to divisiveness.
This is not an issue of "Who is right? Who is wrong?" For, as can be seen from the verses quoted, both have their place.
We both have a problem in one of our Bible study groups with the bringing up of controversial doctrine.
I don't like it when the thought is not on point, but just seems to be someone's hobby horse. My wife doesn't like it because she can see where it will lead.
She wants it stopped before it begins.
I want the attitudes that engender the divisiveness to be stopped.
I feel we have an opportunity to show how we can learn to speak with gentleness rather than get heated because someone's view is different from our own.
She doesn't want the intensity to show up at all.
Discussion:
(please try to avoid a right/wrong in this)
What is your experience in these kinds of situations?
What do you feel is at the root of discussions that become heated?
What is the leader's responsibility when intense debate shows up in a gathering?
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4 comments:
Discussion:
(please try to avoid a right/wrong in this)
What is your experience in these kinds of situations? I TRY TO DETERMINE THE HEART OF THE INDIVIDUAL BRINGING UP CONTROVERSIAL POSITIONS. IS THERE HURT, UNRESOLVED ISSUES, A LEGITIMATE COMPLAINT- THEN I LISTEN AND TRY TO SORT THROUGH THE PROBLEM AREA. MUCH LIKE A DOCTOR LISTENS TO A PATIENT BEFORE MAKING A DIAGNOSIS, A GOOD BIBLE TEACHER CAN SORT THROUGH SOME OF THOSE ISSUES AND GIVE THE RIGHT DIAGNOSIS (SCRIPTURAL THOUGHT) TO HELP THE INDIVIDUAL.
What do you feel is at the root of discussions that become heated? I BELIEVE THAT THERE CAN BE SEVERAL REASONS FOR HEATED DISCUSSIONS AND THEIR ROOT. JESUS KNEW THE HEARTS OF INDIVIDUALS AND ANSWERED ACCORDINGLY. PROVERBS GIVES US IDEAS ABOUT HOW TO ANSWER A FOOL IN HIS FOLLY. AGAIN, I TRY TO ASCERTAIN THE ATTITUDE AND HEART OF THE PERSON. IF IT IS JUST AN AX TO GRIND, I SIDE STEP IT AND MOVE THE DISCUSSION FORWARD. IF THE PERSON IS VERY INTELLECTUAL AND IS TRULY WRESTLING WITH THE ISSUES- I WILL CAMP THERE AND TRY TO HELP THE PERSON GET SOME ANSWERS. I NEVER WANT TO RUN FROM HARD OR DIFFICULT TOPICS OR SITUATIONS. WE SERVE A "BIG" GOD AND HE CAN HANDLE ANY HEATED DISCUSSION. SOMETHING I READ ON YOUR WEBSITE RECENTLY WAS THAT "JOB WANTED ANSWERS FROM GOD, BUT GOD GAVE HIM INSIGHT." I THINK THAT IS VERY APPROPPRIATE. SOMETIMES PEOPLE DON'T NEED ANSWERS, BUT INSIGHT FROM GOD. THE SCRIPTURES ARE CLEAR THAT IF A PERSON IS DIVISIVE, YOU WARN HIM ONCE AND THEN HAVE NOTHING TO DO WITH HIM. MAY GOD GIVE US DISCERNMENT AS LEADERS TO KNOW GOD'S HEART AND THEN THE HEARTS OF THOSE AROUND US.
What is the leader's responsibility when intense debate shows up in a gathering? AGAIN, I DO NOT SHY AWAY FROM INTENSE DEBATE, UNLESS PEOPLE ARE GETTING HURT. IN COLLEGE I HAD AN ETHICS PROFESSOR THAT WAS AN INTENSE DEBATOR, AND SOMETIMES THERE WERE GIRLS THAT WOULD END UP CRYING. I WOULD NEVER GO THAT FAR, BUT I DO BELIEVE IN A CERTAIN PEDAGOGY THAT SAYS, "THE BEST WAY TO CREATE A RAPID LEARNING ENVIRONMENT IS TO CREATE COGNITIVE DISSONANCE IN THE LEARNER'S MIND TO MAKE ONE HAVE TO CHOOSE BETWEEN TO RADICALLY DIFFERENT IDEAS. IN THE DISSONANCE, YOU CAUSE THE MIND TO HAVE TO SHIFT OR MOVE; HENCE LEARNING BEGINS." I BELIEVE THAT SOMETIMES IT TAKES A HEATED DEBATE TO GET SOME PEOPLE OFF OF "HIGH CENTER." IN SUMMARY, I WOULD NOT WANT TO WRECK SOMEONE'S FAITH TO TRY TO BUILD IT AGAIN. IT WAS SAID OF JESUS THAT "A SMOLDERING WICK HE WOULD NOT SNUFF OUT." I NEVER WANT TO CRUSH FAITH BUT TO BUILD IT! - PASTOR NOEL
In response to Pastor Noel,
I like your statement, LISTEN AND TRY TO SORT THROUGH THE PROBLEM AREA. So often we don't listen but just jump right in trying to fix it, whatever it is. Instead of listening, we immediately want to jump in with our own version, point of view, etc.
"..an unhealthy desire to quibble over the meaning of words. This stirs up arguments ending in jealousy, fighting, slander, and evil suspicions." from Timothy. This is the trap I sense sometimes and wish to avoid.
"...command them in God's name to stop fighting over words. Such arguments are useless, and they can ruin those who hear them." again from Timothy. When we discuss God's Word are we careful to stick with God's Word?
I have much less knowledge than those more mature than me. So, when I'm teaching a class and this problem comes up...can I agree that it's a legitimate argument, and then re-direct the class for lack of knowledge? And confess the lack of knowledge to the class? I'm only asking this if it is an argument for the sake of argument.
Jen,
Every situation calls for its own answer, so there is no "cut & dried" "tried & true" "black & white" way to respond.
Always try to discern the intent. As in this case, you said when "argument for the sake of argument."
I would caution against using the word 'argument' because most people will react negatively and miss the point.
I would say, "Good point," or "Good question." "Could we discuss that at another time?"
If the question is not on point of what is being taught, but only is an oblique reference to some verse that may have been shared, then I would try to avoid being taken into that discussion.
For more help, see the first set of comments on this subject, check with your pastor or Sunday School Superintendent, or go to www.practicalbibleteaching.com and order the e-book "Teach the Bible to Change Lives" available on the Partners page.
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